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Aift
July 21st, 2007, 12:12 AM
George W. Bush who has already declared himself a dictator in the case of a national emergency has now issued an executive order that effectively destroys the Fifth Amendment.

A few days ago, Bush signed a new executive order in which he uses broad language to claim that he has the power to seize the property of any person who undermines efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq. The language in the executive order is broadly defined and does not specifically identify a specific group of individuals that the order applies to. It opens up the possibility of anti-war protesters and other political dissidents having their property confiscated for simply speaking out against the war.

Below is section 1 of the order. Click here for the full text of Bush’s order (http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/07/20070717-3.html).

Section 1. (a) Except to the extent provided in section 203(b)(1), (3), and (4) of IEEPA (50 U.S.C. 1702(b)(1), (3), and (4)), or in regulations, orders, directives, or licenses that may be issued pursuant to this order, and notwithstanding any contract entered into or any license or permit granted prior to the date of this order, all property and interests in property of the following persons, that are in the United States, that hereafter come within the United States, or that are or hereafter come within the possession or control of United States persons, are blocked and may not be transferred, paid, exported, withdrawn, or otherwise dealt in: any person determined by the Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Defense,

(i) to have committed, or to pose a significant risk of committing, an act or acts of violence that have the purpose or effect of:

(A) threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq; or

(B) undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq or to provide humanitarian assistance to the Iraqi people;

(ii) to have materially assisted, sponsored, or provided financial, material, logistical, or technical support for, or goods or services in support of, such an act or acts of violence or any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order; or

(iii) to be owned or controlled by, or to have acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order.

(b) The prohibitions in subsection (a) of this section include, but are not limited to, (i) the making of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services by, to, or for the benefit of any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order, and (ii) the receipt of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services from any such person.

The language in this executive order is incredibly disturbing. Undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction as cited above is broadly defined and could mean anybody that speaks out against the Iraq war. Essentially, Bush is declaring that he can take people’s property without due process if the government determines that in some way a person is undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq. Bush fails to mention The Fifth Amendment or due process anywhere in the order.

Below is the full text of the Fifth Amendment. Clearly, this executive order is unconstitutional when you consider that the Fifth Amendment guarantees that a person will not be deprived of property without due process.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

The web site Slashdot posted an article analyzing the Bush executive order (http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/07/07/19/1551242.shtml) and came to the exact same conclusion. Amazingly, the establishment press has spun the coverage of this Bush order as a way to strengthen the government’s ability to fight terrorism (http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,,-6786106,00.html) when the real story is that this order violates the Fifth Amendment and is entirely unconstitutional. George W. Bush is a criminal who has violated his oath of office on countless occasions. This is yet another one of those occasions. He needs to be impeached and put on trial immediately.

http://www.roguegovernment.com/news.php?id=3127


At times like this, don't you just want the world to end? How about he just impeach George Bush! Hey *******, screw Iraq and its reconstruction, you've already taken some rights away, whats next?

hoverbike
July 21st, 2007, 03:23 AM
This is just more of what Bush wants and his special agenda. It's not about what's best for America, it's what's best for him and the Elite. The situation is becoming more and more dangerous with this man in power, they need to impeach him immediately. I'd be pretty angry right now if I were an American.

Carsonal
July 21st, 2007, 03:27 AM
Can someone fill me in on what the 5th amendment is?

Aift
July 21st, 2007, 05:02 AM
Can someone fill me in on what the 5th amendment is?

Here is the fifth amendement text, or what it used to be:


No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation

Carsonal
July 21st, 2007, 05:56 AM
And uhh...is anyone doing anything to stop this?

hoverbike
July 21st, 2007, 07:22 AM
And uhh...is anyone doing anything to stop this?

I'm sure a large amount of people are trying to stop this but it's difficult with the insanity that is ensuring now. The mass media won't talk much about these things if at all, even though they easily are huge stories, bigger then 95% of the current news items.

Aift
July 21st, 2007, 04:24 PM
No, no one is trying to stop this.

And yes, I agree, this is much bigger than the large majority of the news broadcasts, but instead, we get a 9 hour special on Paris Hilton!

hgmaster
August 6th, 2007, 03:26 AM
Most executive orders are a bit crazy, its very hard to get the american people to wake up to the fact that our rights are being striped from us, they are to busy with there ipods myspace and PS3, LOL.

udontneed2know
August 7th, 2007, 05:16 AM
Hmmm ... a president stepping on an admendment? No way.

" Looks at liberals signing the Fairness Doctrine "

Oh wait, liberals are attacking Freedom of Speech, freedom of choice, freedom of pretty much everything.

But if you actually look at what is written, it isn't anything special at all, pretty standard stuff. Stating that people could be criminally prosecuted if they try to undermine the efforts of our troops in Iraq. Wow how devilish. So you mean I can't go and tell Al-Queda where our troops are in Iraq? BUSH IS SATAN.

Really people, you need to learn to read a little.

And furthermore, the author of this overly sadistic letter doesn't even read the 5th admendment.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

This is a time of War and cause for public danger. Which is plainly stated IN the 5th admendment. See? The four fathers were FAR smarter then all of you people.

hgmaster
August 7th, 2007, 07:20 AM
threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq

The one who has most violated this is Bush himself so it kind of ironic

slingblade10
August 7th, 2007, 07:23 AM
Ron Paul in 08. Down with big government.

One-Shot
August 7th, 2007, 07:35 AM
The one who has most violated this is Bush himself so it kind of ironic
So you liked saddams "government"?

hgmaster
August 7th, 2007, 08:46 PM
So you liked saddams "government"?

No not all all, I am not a fan of any government really. I dont believe our forces are helping the poeple in Iraq as much as we are hurting them. Just Imagine you lived in Iraq, how long would it take you to start to hate american soliders?

shcndw
August 7th, 2007, 10:33 PM
No not all all, I am not a fan of any government really. I dont believe our forces are helping the poeple in Iraq as much as we are hurting them. Just Imagine you lived in Iraq, how long would it take you to start to hate american soliders?

Not long. You can't really blame them though, they're doing there jobs.

PS3GamerKyle
August 8th, 2007, 04:42 AM
George W. Bush who has already declared himself a dictator in the case of a national emergency has now issued an executive order that effectively destroys the Fifth Amendment.

A few days ago, Bush signed a new executive order in which he uses broad language to claim that he has the power to seize the property of any person who undermines efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq. The language in the executive order is broadly defined and does not specifically identify a specific group of individuals that the order applies to. It opens up the possibility of anti-war protesters and other political dissidents having their property confiscated for simply speaking out against the war.

Below is section 1 of the order. Click here for the full text of Bush’s order (http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/07/20070717-3.html).

Section 1. (a) Except to the extent provided in section 203(b)(1), (3), and (4) of IEEPA (50 U.S.C. 1702(b)(1), (3), and (4)), or in regulations, orders, directives, or licenses that may be issued pursuant to this order, and notwithstanding any contract entered into or any license or permit granted prior to the date of this order, all property and interests in property of the following persons, that are in the United States, that hereafter come within the United States, or that are or hereafter come within the possession or control of United States persons, are blocked and may not be transferred, paid, exported, withdrawn, or otherwise dealt in: any person determined by the Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Defense,

(i) to have committed, or to pose a significant risk of committing, an act or acts of violence that have the purpose or effect of:

(A) threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq; or

(B) undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq or to provide humanitarian assistance to the Iraqi people;

(ii) to have materially assisted, sponsored, or provided financial, material, logistical, or technical support for, or goods or services in support of, such an act or acts of violence or any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order; or

(iii) to be owned or controlled by, or to have acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order.

(b) The prohibitions in subsection (a) of this section include, but are not limited to, (i) the making of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services by, to, or for the benefit of any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order, and (ii) the receipt of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services from any such person.

The language in this executive order is incredibly disturbing. Undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction as cited above is broadly defined and could mean anybody that speaks out against the Iraq war. Essentially, Bush is declaring that he can take people’s property without due process if the government determines that in some way a person is undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq. Bush fails to mention The Fifth Amendment or due process anywhere in the order.

Below is the full text of the Fifth Amendment. Clearly, this executive order is unconstitutional when you consider that the Fifth Amendment guarantees that a person will not be deprived of property without due process.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

The web site Slashdot posted an article analyzing the Bush executive order (http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/07/07/19/1551242.shtml) and came to the exact same conclusion. Amazingly, the establishment press has spun the coverage of this Bush order as a way to strengthen the government’s ability to fight terrorism (http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,,-6786106,00.html) when the real story is that this order violates the Fifth Amendment and is entirely unconstitutional. George W. Bush is a criminal who has violated his oath of office on countless occasions. This is yet another one of those occasions. He needs to be impeached and put on trial immediately.

http://www.roguegovernment.com/news.php?id=3127 (http://www.roguegovernment.com/news.php?id=3127)

So what I am getting from this is if George Bush, or any govermental angency, can accuse someone for "(A) threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq;" when all they are doing is protesting for anti-war?

They are stripping us of our rights..

One-Shot
August 8th, 2007, 05:22 AM
So what I am getting from this is if George Bush, or any govermental angency, can accuse someone for "(A) threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq;" when all they are doing is protesting for anti-war?

They are stripping us of our rights..
Wow if thats what your getting you need to read it again.

BTW couldnt the topic creater find something thats not on a far left website where you dont get both sides? Or would the left just get owned if confronted.....again.

knowitman
August 8th, 2007, 06:14 AM
No not all all, I am not a fan of any government really. I dont believe our forces are helping the poeple in Iraq as much as we are hurting them. Just Imagine you lived in Iraq, how long would it take you to start to hate american soliders?

I guess that's why according to a BBC poll, a majority of Iraqi citizens want the American soldiers in Iraq. I guess we should let the left wing media speak for the Iraqi people rather then let the people speak for themselves. It's not us that are doing anything to the Iraqi citizens. It's all the insurgents which are an outside group. Why are the insurgents attacking? I can assure you that it's so they can take power over the Iraqi citizens when we leave.

Terz
August 8th, 2007, 06:15 AM
Bush doesn't have to power to do this. Congress has the final say...

One-Shot
August 8th, 2007, 06:15 AM
I guess that's why according to a BBC poll, a majority of Iraqi citizens want the American soldiers in Iraq. I guess we should let the left wing media speak for the Iraqi people rather then let the people speak for themselves. It's not us that are doing anything to the Iraqi citizens. It's all the insurgents which are an outside group. Why are the insurgents attacking? I can assure you that it's so they can take power over the Iraqi citizens when we leave.
Cant forget Iran and the people they have in iraq.

PXG S3
August 8th, 2007, 06:50 AM
Why did people vote for this *****...WHY!!???!!! Even when we do have a new president, they will never be able to repair the damage he has done to America or the world......Thanks a lot Bush...THANKS!

One-Shot
August 8th, 2007, 06:55 AM
Why did people vote for this *****...WHY!!???!!! Even when we do have a new president, they will never be able to repair the damage he has done to America or the world......Thanks a lot Bush...THANKS!
Umm confronting terrorism a liberating 2 countries is damage?

macel82
August 8th, 2007, 08:35 AM
First of all, try reading the whole thing. Don't just look at it and go "Oh jeez, this is a big, long, technically-worded document full of legalese so it must be complicated and bad. I'll just let someone else paraphrase it for me." If this is so bad, then why doesn't the brilliant liberal Congress do something about it? After all, we elected them to stop this dictator of a President. No, instead they go along with his antics. So maybe they're not so bad after all.
As someone else stated, we are at war, and during war the President reserves certain rights to do things that, though unpopular, are necessary to protect our country and our interests. As far as I know, this law would only apply to people who are deemed an immediate threat to our security. And if that's the case, I hope they do more to them than just take their possessions. I think this applies to people a little more serious than anti-war protestors.
And to all the people who keep *****ing about the Patriot Act and other things of this nature that "Bush" has supposedly done, even though Congress has approved almost all of it, where are all of the supposedly innocent people being dragged out of their homes and thrown in jail for no reason? The way you guys describe things, there would certainly have to be hundreds if not thousands of people who are wrongly accused of these things. Where are they?